Encountering GOD | John Giftah | Vivian Williams (Iconic Worship) Interview (Part 1)

0:01 Speaker 1: Do you ever look around and think, Wow, the world

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0:08 Speaker 1: crazier and crazier. Ease your mind and take a break.

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0:41 Speaker 1: Welcome to Fuel for the Soul with John GIFTA.

0:49 Speaker 2: Hey, everybody, is such a joy for me to be

0:50 Speaker 2: with all of you today, and it's such a joy

0:53 Speaker 2: that after a long break, I'm back into the interviewing

0:57 Speaker 2: scene and I'm so excited to have with us to

1:00 Speaker 2: the Vivian who is the founder of iconic worship and

1:05 Speaker 2: the moment that is just making such amazing waves across

1:09 Speaker 2: the Christian world. I'm so happy that you're with us today, Vivian.

1:13 Speaker 3: Thank you John.

1:14 Speaker 4: It is a pleasure to be I've been watching you

1:16 Speaker 4: know you on YouTube and Instagram for so long and

1:19 Speaker 4: when I met your at j J Church. I don't

1:22 Speaker 4: know you go to that church, but it's a pleasure

1:24 Speaker 4: to be watching your videos to be finally sitting in

1:27 Speaker 4: your day.

1:28 Speaker 2: Thank you so much, and I'm also so grateful to

1:31 Speaker 2: have you, especially you know, restarting this whole interviewing scene

1:35 Speaker 2: and that too, to started with you is such an

1:38 Speaker 2: awesome thing. And I've always been dreaming every time I

1:41 Speaker 2: come to Iconic worship. Guys, I always say this, right,

1:45 Speaker 2: you know, the best things in the world are always

1:46 Speaker 2: like you have an iPhone or an iPad, and when

1:49 Speaker 2: it comes to the best part of worship is Iconic,

1:52 Speaker 2: So you know, it's really amazing and not just making

1:56 Speaker 2: this up. I couldn't come very frequently because of my schedule,

2:00 Speaker 2: but every time I came, whether it's three or four times,

2:03 Speaker 2: it's always been such a blessing.

2:05 Speaker 5: Guys.

2:06 Speaker 2: I really recommend you to check it out. I think

2:08 Speaker 2: you guys are traveling across the globe doing these sessions

2:11 Speaker 2: and I want you to be plugged into it.

2:13 Speaker 5: And it's amazing.

2:15 Speaker 2: Right even though this is the first time we're sitting

2:17 Speaker 2: together and talking like this, I don't know I've not

2:21 Speaker 2: shared this with you, but there were so many times

2:23 Speaker 2: or very regularly. I'm led by God to specifically pray

2:27 Speaker 2: for you. I've been praying for you for I don't

2:29 Speaker 2: know ever since I got to know you. I think

2:31 Speaker 2: I had the privilege of attending your very first iconic.

2:34 Speaker 3: Worship, iconic one. Yes you had come.

2:43 Speaker 4: When we were just we just started off the first

2:45 Speaker 4: iconic yes.

2:46 Speaker 5: Yes, yes.

2:47 Speaker 2: So they always say no, the first impression is the

2:51 Speaker 2: best impression. So it's so good to have you. And

2:55 Speaker 2: at the same time, you know, there's so many people

2:57 Speaker 2: you get to know. Oh, this is Vivian and you

3:00 Speaker 2: doing this iconic worship. But why don't you give a

3:02 Speaker 2: little introduction about yourself in a way that I always

3:07 Speaker 2: believe the best introduction is self introduction.

3:10 Speaker 4: Oh, I am the founder of Iconic Worship. It's a

3:14 Speaker 4: worship movement across Bangalore. We come from different churches and

3:18 Speaker 4: we worship in these open spaces usually, but now we've

3:22 Speaker 4: been shifting to close door spaces because of better sound

3:26 Speaker 4: quality and because of those reasons. But yeah, our aim

3:30 Speaker 4: is to unite churches. Our aim is to bring young

3:33 Speaker 4: people together. Forget our differences for good or theological difference.

3:37 Speaker 4: Because we have more than forty five thousand denominations. Right,

3:40 Speaker 4: So if you say that, okay, I'm gonna check my

3:42 Speaker 4: theology before worshiping, you'd be worshipping on and off forever.

3:46 Speaker 5: Yes, it's true.

3:48 Speaker 4: My motto is that, Okay, you love Jesus, we love Jesus.

3:52 Speaker 4: Let's worship him together. So that's the heart at what

3:56 Speaker 4: you're doing as iconic worship. And myself a small gist,

4:02 Speaker 4: I never wanted to get into this ministry scene. If

4:07 Speaker 4: we were, I wanted to probably think about it after

4:10 Speaker 4: the age of fifty. I used to be a founder

4:14 Speaker 4: of a company called Swift Tried. Okay, that was the

4:17 Speaker 4: current bike pulling up for college students.

4:19 Speaker 5: Oh nice, and you.

4:20 Speaker 3: Know in two years time we got a lot of success.

4:23 Speaker 4: They were part of the Google Startup boot Camp, two

4:28 Speaker 4: bad Microsoft founders hubbed and we also went to the

4:32 Speaker 4: final round of Shark Tank.

4:33 Speaker 3: For some reasons, we couldn't make it.

4:36 Speaker 4: We're part of the Cisco Incubator and we were supposed

4:39 Speaker 4: to go to Silicon Valley Draper University, San Francisco. We

4:43 Speaker 4: silated out of two thousand teams in it. Here and

4:46 Speaker 4: Elan Mosco's a trainer in that institute. Oh Wow, all

4:49 Speaker 4: of these things and that took a small boss. I'm

4:53 Speaker 4: out here building this. That's a background now what I

4:57 Speaker 4: am and what I got to goeship this.

4:59 Speaker 5: That's so good. That's so good.

5:01 Speaker 2: I love how you talked about you know, iconic worship

5:04 Speaker 2: is all about, like irrespect of our denominational differences. You know,

5:09 Speaker 2: I was just talking to somebody this morning and I

5:11 Speaker 2: was just saying this that you know, God is not

5:14 Speaker 2: going to say, oh, you know what because of this

5:16 Speaker 2: small difference in our doctrinal opinion. You know, you're going

5:20 Speaker 2: to stay in hell. You're going to you're not going

5:22 Speaker 2: to make it to Heaven. You know, it's it's because

5:25 Speaker 2: we will have differences, right Like for me, I consider

5:29 Speaker 2: myself like a mixed breed. I'm part of Methodist Church.

5:32 Speaker 2: I also attend a Nady church. I'm my ministry is

5:35 Speaker 2: non denominational. I am exposed to different denominations, and even

5:39 Speaker 2: in my ministry, people of different denominations follow my content.

5:43 Speaker 2: And you know, if you're sometimes looking at like the

5:46 Speaker 2: smallest of doctrinal differences, we're going to miss out on

5:49 Speaker 2: the big pictures.

5:50 Speaker 5: Because I've interviewed lots.

5:53 Speaker 2: Of people, including an Holliwood, actress who has our own

5:57 Speaker 2: ministry as well. She's part of many of the Disney shows,

6:00 Speaker 2: all of these things. And likewise, I don't know if

6:04 Speaker 2: you've heard of something called marc Intel Comedy.

6:06 Speaker 5: It's a very famous comedy from Africa.

6:08 Speaker 2: Yeah, one of the lead actors from Marcantel Comedy based

6:11 Speaker 2: in he saw my content once and started following me.

6:14 Speaker 2: And I was like, oh my gosh, I followed this

6:16 Speaker 2: guy and we connected. And so you know, when you

6:19 Speaker 2: start connecting with people like that who are also loving

6:23 Speaker 2: the Lord and are using their unique spaces to reach

6:26 Speaker 2: out to people, I just feel like, you know, if

6:29 Speaker 2: we are going to limit what God wants to do

6:31 Speaker 2: just because of doctrinal differences, we're missing out on the

6:35 Speaker 2: big picture of reaching the lost absolutely. And I just

6:39 Speaker 2: so loud that you know, we're going into that pace

6:42 Speaker 2: of being into denominational reaching people. And it's amazing you're

6:46 Speaker 2: saying that you're this brainy guy. You know, you're doing

6:49 Speaker 2: so many things like this, And I think there was

6:52 Speaker 2: a moment you encountered God right like God has met you.

6:56 Speaker 2: Was it through a vision or an encounter? What was

6:59 Speaker 2: that all about?

7:00 Speaker 3: So I was.

7:02 Speaker 4: Twelve years old, and I just told I remember there

7:06 Speaker 4: was a fasting prayer from my church, okay, and I

7:08 Speaker 4: couldn't go there because it was.

7:12 Speaker 3: Raining hereous when I was twelve years old.

7:14 Speaker 4: So basically twenty thirteen, twenty twelve thirteen, okay, and I

7:22 Speaker 4: had we were in the fasting prayered. We watched it online.

7:27 Speaker 4: So back in dozen and twelve we had internet at a place.

7:30 Speaker 4: We watched it online. And that's when a lot of

7:34 Speaker 4: people who were present at the church were like, you know,

7:38 Speaker 4: I saw the feet of Jesus. I saw I saw

7:41 Speaker 4: the robe of Jesus, and he immediately took off my

7:44 Speaker 4: sandals and all of these things. And I was like God,

7:49 Speaker 4: like you know, I don't want these seat robe and

7:52 Speaker 4: I want the entire body.

7:53 Speaker 3: I want to see you face to face. Wow, I

7:55 Speaker 3: want to see you face to face.

7:56 Speaker 4: And I remember I told God I was not I'm

8:00 Speaker 4: not desperate for anything in life. The most desperate I've

8:02 Speaker 4: been is for a bicycle. But I'm more to spread

8:05 Speaker 4: for you, and I want to I want to see you.

8:10 Speaker 4: And Pastor just came and you said, okay, cool, I'm

8:13 Speaker 4: going to close the pasting. Then I got mad on God,

8:15 Speaker 4: I'm like, I'm born to pick with you. I'm such

8:19 Speaker 4: a young kid and disappoint me. I'm born to pick

8:22 Speaker 4: with you. I'm so mad at you because I've been

8:25 Speaker 4: so desperately asking to see you. And that's when Pastor

8:30 Speaker 4: us like, no, I want to go for longer.

8:32 Speaker 3: M M.

8:33 Speaker 4: Immediately it was just like, I want to go a

8:35 Speaker 4: longer okay, And then that's when I had a vision

8:38 Speaker 4: of Jesus. Okay, okay, And that's a long vision, but

8:42 Speaker 4: basically in the gist of the vision was Vivian, where

8:47 Speaker 4: is your faith? M So that's when I realized, yes,

8:52 Speaker 4: God loves desperation from us in certain aspects because we

8:56 Speaker 4: forgot about everything else and just focus on Him. But

8:59 Speaker 4: sometimes desperate just doesn't cut it. You require faith as well. Yes, right, so, yeah,

9:05 Speaker 4: that was the encounter I had and within two days

9:08 Speaker 4: I got baptized.

9:09 Speaker 5: Oh that's so good. That's so good.

9:11 Speaker 2: A couple of things that you just talked about was

9:14 Speaker 2: like you had your first encounter when you were at

9:16 Speaker 2: the age of twelve. My encounter with God was at

9:20 Speaker 2: the age of eleven, Like call was very similar and

9:23 Speaker 2: when was it Benny Hills, Yes, yes, yes, the.

9:28 Speaker 5: People of Bangalorelia.

9:30 Speaker 1: Do you want the free offer of Jesus Christ.

9:34 Speaker 2: Oh, it was at Pastor Beni Hint's huge crusade in Bangalore.

9:37 Speaker 3: That has a photo of you holding a ticket to that.

9:41 Speaker 4: Yes, I have the ticket, Yes I do, I think

9:44 Speaker 4: Instagram right, Yes I did.

9:45 Speaker 3: Two thousand and.

9:46 Speaker 2: Five, two thousand and five January twenty twenty three. I'll

9:50 Speaker 2: never forget that. It's that was the first time I

9:53 Speaker 2: encountered the Lord.

9:54 Speaker 3: Like.

9:55 Speaker 2: I'm from a background like where many people don't believe

9:59 Speaker 2: in the gifts of the spirit or the annointing. There's

10:01 Speaker 2: not much of importance or there's a lot of ignorance,

10:04 Speaker 2: and many of them actually don't even believe in those things.

10:06 Speaker 2: According to many of them are sessionists. I don't know

10:09 Speaker 2: if you heard those terminologies. So sessionists are those who

10:11 Speaker 2: believe that the gifts of the spirit seas in the

10:13 Speaker 2: Bible times so that they don't exist anymore. So I

10:18 Speaker 2: didn't have that kind of an upbringing where I've seen

10:20 Speaker 2: miracles or I was like, you know, somebody else is

10:24 Speaker 2: of a different fate. I'm of this fate. That's all

10:26 Speaker 2: I would think of. But when I saw like miracles

10:30 Speaker 2: in front of me as eleven year old kid and

10:33 Speaker 2: seeing the impact, seeing that, Oh my gosh, Jesus, you're

10:36 Speaker 2: real because before that, the only reason I lowed going

10:39 Speaker 2: to church was the chocolate cakes at the end of

10:41 Speaker 2: the service and nothing else. But after seeing the reality

10:45 Speaker 2: of God, and that's where I experience I didn't understand

10:48 Speaker 2: much because I was just eleven years old, but I,

10:52 Speaker 2: you know, like experienced a part of the Holy Spirit

10:54 Speaker 2: like fire on me, like a huge warmth something like

10:59 Speaker 2: I didn't understan and what was going on, and Pastor

11:02 Speaker 2: Menu was saying, you know, some of your experiencing, that's

11:04 Speaker 2: from the Holy Spirit. And that's when I experienced a

11:07 Speaker 2: touch of the Holy Spirit, like electricity flowing through me.

11:10 Speaker 2: And in that crusade, I said, Lord, I didn't know

11:13 Speaker 2: you were so real. I want you to use me

11:15 Speaker 2: like this to tell others about you. And now I

11:19 Speaker 2: see that translated into my life as I travel and preach,

11:25 Speaker 2: and that's been my heart. The ministry's name is John

11:27 Speaker 2: Gift International. You know, even I called it international on

11:31 Speaker 2: the first day of starting the ministry, even when it

11:34 Speaker 2: was not international. But that was what fate was all about.

11:38 Speaker 2: And now after thirteen years of starting the ministry. I

11:42 Speaker 2: had my first international preaching opportunity earlier this year. So

11:46 Speaker 2: I always tell people, you know, you never know like

11:48 Speaker 2: one encounter where it's going to lead you and you

11:52 Speaker 2: were desperate for that right at that moment.

11:54 Speaker 5: And one more thing the Lot.

11:56 Speaker 2: Put in my heart is you know, God doesn't just

11:59 Speaker 2: give you encomes for you to talk about it, but

12:02 Speaker 2: he gives you the encounters so that you'll do something

12:04 Speaker 2: about it. Now, a lot of times we want encounters

12:07 Speaker 2: only so that you know, a I had an encounter

12:09 Speaker 2: like even I've had encounters like the Lord took me

12:12 Speaker 2: and showed me glimpses of Hell three times. Those were

12:15 Speaker 2: like very scary encounters. There were encounters where I've seen miracles,

12:21 Speaker 2: so many people getting healed and all of that, but

12:23 Speaker 2: it's not something I just want to talk about. Yeah

12:25 Speaker 2: I've seen hell, you know, and stuff like that, but

12:27 Speaker 2: I want that should translate into my life to say,

12:31 Speaker 2: you know what, I don't want people going into hell.

12:33 Speaker 5: That's why I'm doing what I'm doing.

12:35 Speaker 2: Because I have a full time job, i have a

12:37 Speaker 2: lot of opposition for doing what I'm doing, but I'm

12:40 Speaker 2: still paying the price to do this because of that.

12:43 Speaker 2: So I think sometimes that's the thing that we need

12:46 Speaker 2: to have about encounters like God, I'm desperate for you,

12:51 Speaker 2: but not just desperate for the encounter. So like, so,

12:56 Speaker 2: but how did this translate into your life? Like you

13:00 Speaker 2: got baptized, But how did that translate into your work

13:03 Speaker 2: with God?

13:04 Speaker 3: Yeah?

13:05 Speaker 4: Funnily enough, after six months of that happening, close to

13:09 Speaker 4: one year off that happened, I became an atheist.

13:12 Speaker 5: Oh my goodness. Okay, we'll hold it right there.

13:15 Speaker 2: You became an atheist after one year of becoming after

13:19 Speaker 2: encountering all around that time. Okay, before we go to

13:23 Speaker 2: this part, this is so interesting, but I want to

13:25 Speaker 2: ask this question though, Like a lot of times people say,

13:28 Speaker 2: you know, God encounter is only the big people like

13:31 Speaker 2: Benihan or someone like that. What is your message on

13:35 Speaker 2: how God actually encounters even the young people. God encounted me,

13:38 Speaker 2: God encounted you and while you were still young.

13:40 Speaker 4: I think God is searching for those who are desperate

13:45 Speaker 4: and those who have faith. That's the that's the answer.

13:51 Speaker 4: You know, I don't think there is any and what

13:57 Speaker 4: do you say, selective encounters? But like you told, after

14:03 Speaker 4: every encounter, something is born. You know, you can't just

14:06 Speaker 4: keep the encounter to yourself and just talk about it

14:09 Speaker 4: or post some story about it, real about it, and

14:12 Speaker 4: forget about it. Something has to be born because an

14:16 Speaker 4: encounter has a reason, and probably you might not see

14:19 Speaker 4: it at that time, but there is a reason because

14:24 Speaker 4: in the encounter itself, I had seen a vision of

14:27 Speaker 4: me preaching to millions of people wearing a coat and

14:32 Speaker 4: a suit. So that encountered carried even the plan. Okay, cool,

14:36 Speaker 4: I've met you. But you know it's like how these

14:40 Speaker 4: big let's say, if a politician comes to meet you,

14:44 Speaker 4: he doesn't come to meet you, or a let's say,

14:46 Speaker 4: a big business man says I want to meet John.

14:48 Speaker 4: He doesn't come and says Hi, John, drink a coffee

14:50 Speaker 4: and go off to have a plan, Like okay, why

14:53 Speaker 4: is he meeting John? Okay, probably want to do some

14:55 Speaker 4: business and Bangalo probably wants to open a restaurant on

14:58 Speaker 4: stopen a cafe something with you. That's why he's taking

15:01 Speaker 4: his time, flying from a different country, coming and meeting you.

15:05 Speaker 4: So if that's true for that's a human, how much

15:09 Speaker 4: more true it's for God. If God is coming and

15:10 Speaker 4: meeting you, just not coming to Okay, Hi, how are

15:13 Speaker 4: you giving you some shock electricity and some rainbow stories

15:17 Speaker 4: and okay, bye bye, see you.

15:18 Speaker 3: Nice meeting. You know.

15:19 Speaker 4: Sure there's a reason and the purpose why he encounters us.

15:23 Speaker 4: So yeah, I think anyone can get an encounter from God.

15:28 Speaker 4: And the secret is being desperate at having faith, because

15:31 Speaker 4: for a long time I thought it was desperation. Actually,

15:34 Speaker 4: very recently when I was telling my testimony about the

15:36 Speaker 4: vision is when I realized, okay, it is not just

15:39 Speaker 4: desperation but also faith. Yes, some people are very desperate

15:42 Speaker 4: but they don't have faith. Some people have faith, but

15:47 Speaker 4: they're not even they're not desperate enough desperate. Okay, I

15:50 Speaker 4: have faith like an arrogant faith. In some cases it

15:54 Speaker 4: works and some places it is good to have that arrogant,

15:57 Speaker 4: stubborn faith.

15:58 Speaker 3: It is good.

15:59 Speaker 4: But I think with encounter with God you to have

16:02 Speaker 4: a desperate faith. Hmm, yeah, that's so true.

16:06 Speaker 2: I was just reminded like when you were sharing, like

16:08 Speaker 2: when you meet with a business person, and this was

16:11 Speaker 2: a revelation that God actually gave me on a very

16:14 Speaker 2: similar line, like when Joseph met the what is his name,

16:19 Speaker 2: the Pharaoh? Right, Yeah, when Joseph met the Pharaoh, It's

16:22 Speaker 2: not like, oh, you met the pharaoh and then you

16:24 Speaker 2: walk out the same. You know, when you meet a king,

16:28 Speaker 2: an earthly king, you're not going to walk out the same.

16:31 Speaker 2: Then what is your guarantee that when you meet the

16:34 Speaker 2: king of kings you're not going to work out the same.

16:36 Speaker 2: There will be a mandate, there will be a transformation,

16:39 Speaker 2: there will be a change that will translate into your life.

16:42 Speaker 5: To be a greater blessing to other people.

16:44 Speaker 2: And that is something that we really really need to

16:48 Speaker 2: like emphasize on, like, you know, when it comes to this,

16:51 Speaker 2: because a lot of times people like in very similar lines, right.

16:55 Speaker 2: I think there was a moment when I don't know

16:57 Speaker 2: if you heard of Shaida Matthew, Yes, so when he

17:00 Speaker 2: had come to Karinia while I was in the second

17:02 Speaker 2: year of first year in college. While I'm in this

17:06 Speaker 2: one of these meetings, I just look up and I

17:10 Speaker 2: sends angels on one particular side of the place, and

17:17 Speaker 2: I'm just like, are you sure?

17:18 Speaker 5: God? Is this you?

17:19 Speaker 3: Is this?

17:19 Speaker 5: Are these real angels? Or am I just hallisinating?

17:23 Speaker 2: And just two minutes later, Hygiomatic turns to the same

17:26 Speaker 2: direction and he says.

17:28 Speaker 5: There are angels in that same place.

17:30 Speaker 2: So it's an act of like you said, you know

17:32 Speaker 2: that desperation, like God, I want to encounter you, but

17:36 Speaker 2: at the same time having the faith to say, you

17:38 Speaker 2: know what, yes, I believe this is an angelic thing,

17:41 Speaker 2: you know, like and the next minute or I remember

17:44 Speaker 2: once I met with somebody and I went to pray,

17:46 Speaker 2: to pray for someone in their house, and then I

17:49 Speaker 2: just turn and then I see or in the vision,

17:52 Speaker 2: like you know, an angel in a particular place. And

17:54 Speaker 2: I just took this step of fate and said, I

17:56 Speaker 2: see an angel in this place near next to a window.

17:59 Speaker 2: And then they said, this is like a confirmation for

18:02 Speaker 2: us for God's protection, because some robbers were trying through

18:07 Speaker 2: that very same window just two days before that, trying

18:10 Speaker 2: to rob their house. So that's like her way. God

18:15 Speaker 2: says that you know, there is the desperation, but you

18:18 Speaker 2: take the slip of faith and then you see that

18:21 Speaker 2: this was of God, you know what I mean. So

18:25 Speaker 2: coming back to this aspect, you said that you just

18:28 Speaker 2: encountered God, but within a year became an atheist. I

18:32 Speaker 2: don't know if you've heard of this movie series. It's

18:34 Speaker 2: basically based on a book. It's called The Perfect stranger.

18:38 Speaker 2: The second part of it is called the per Another

18:41 Speaker 2: perfect Stranger. It's so beautiful. Maybe i'll share that with you.

18:44 Speaker 2: It's one of my favorites. So it's basically how Jesus

18:47 Speaker 2: meets with a lady. She's an atheist. Jesus meets with

18:52 Speaker 2: a lady, has dinner with her, and her life has

18:55 Speaker 2: changed completely. And then the second part is about her

18:58 Speaker 2: daughter encountering Gus where she's an atheist because she's like,

19:03 Speaker 2: what is this?

19:04 Speaker 5: My mom is so crazy.

19:05 Speaker 2: She met with Jesus's in but Jesus meets with her

19:08 Speaker 2: in the plane itself. And then comes the third part

19:14 Speaker 2: with that mom who I initially encountered. Jesus starts doubting

19:18 Speaker 2: because things have just faded away, you know what I mean,

19:21 Speaker 2: Like the minute you said that you encountered the lot,

19:25 Speaker 2: but still you turned out into the direction of atheism.

19:28 Speaker 2: Like it's really something. It's not something like people on

19:31 Speaker 2: the outside will be like, hey, you know what, how

19:34 Speaker 2: dare you? Like you're so stupid your you know, how

19:37 Speaker 2: could you be so blinded? But what do you think

19:40 Speaker 2: with some factors that took you in the direction. I'll

19:44 Speaker 2: just tell you why I'm asking this question right now,

19:46 Speaker 2: those who are watching maybe saying, you know, I'm strong

19:48 Speaker 2: in God, I have encountered God. But what if they

19:51 Speaker 2: are taking some steps or they're making some mistakes which

19:56 Speaker 2: could lead them in the same path as what led you.

20:02 Speaker 3: See.

20:02 Speaker 4: The thing is, I would like to compare this to

20:06 Speaker 4: people winning the lottery. Okay, let's say your income is

20:10 Speaker 4: this all your life income is like this, okay, and

20:15 Speaker 4: suddenly you've been a lottery and your income is like this.

20:19 Speaker 4: Nineteen eight percent of lottery winners become bankrupt. Oh okay, yeah,

20:24 Speaker 4: most of them bankrupt then again have a fall because

20:29 Speaker 4: there is no growth to it, compared to people who

20:33 Speaker 4: gotten wealth through running a business, you know, every step

20:37 Speaker 4: of the way, they'll learned to sustain.

20:41 Speaker 3: The money and know how to manage money.

20:43 Speaker 4: So they don't see that all usually, but over here

20:46 Speaker 4: it's it happened in a second. Similarly, the logical reason

20:52 Speaker 4: why people who experiences, especially me, tolers of our life

20:57 Speaker 4: zero encounters with God and one day a huge encounters,

21:00 Speaker 4: but that encounter was not followed with or do you say,

21:03 Speaker 4: maintaining a relationship with them. I tried my best, you

21:07 Speaker 4: know here, and then I tried but I failed to

21:10 Speaker 4: an extent where I started to doubt everything. Was it

21:12 Speaker 4: really my imagination or said this or said that? And

21:16 Speaker 4: I started reading a lot of these books on philosophy

21:22 Speaker 4: on nihilism, uh, and yeah, I became I believe that.

21:28 Speaker 4: So nihilism, basically, that entire concept of concept is even

21:32 Speaker 4: if God exists, there is no point. Okay, Okay, it's

21:36 Speaker 4: worse than it is. Okay, let's imagine what cont exists

21:39 Speaker 4: off the front. So a few of those philosophies, and yeah,

21:44 Speaker 4: I started doubting everything. So extreme belief, extreme disbelief had gone.

21:52 Speaker 4: And one of the reasons because I didn't have a

21:55 Speaker 4: habit and a routine to handle that kind of divine encounter,

22:00 Speaker 4: you know, wasn't myself didn't know how to handle it.

22:05 Speaker 4: So yeah, because of that, that's the main reason that happened.

22:09 Speaker 4: But thankfully, after like you know, six months of being

22:12 Speaker 4: that delation belief, I come back to God and started

22:17 Speaker 4: to believe him again, but again not as as how. Yeah,

22:22 Speaker 4: it's like it's like, you know, I was over here

22:23 Speaker 4: an event here in India, and I'm back here. It's

22:26 Speaker 4: back talking you exist, I believe you. It makes sense, Okay,

22:30 Speaker 4: But you know, you stay there, I'll stay here. You

22:32 Speaker 4: don't interfere in my life. I don't interfere in you.

22:36 Speaker 3: That's what happened.

22:37 Speaker 5: Okay.

22:38 Speaker 2: So based on what you're saying, I think it's the

22:41 Speaker 2: fact that you encountered God, but you didn't take any

22:44 Speaker 2: step based on it.

22:45 Speaker 5: That's the point.

22:46 Speaker 2: It's like a lot of people like, oh, you know

22:48 Speaker 2: what I encountered Like like you said, you know, you

22:50 Speaker 2: meet a politician or you meet somebody popular, but you

22:53 Speaker 2: didn't take any step based on it, you know, Like

22:57 Speaker 2: I was just reminded from the top of my head

22:59 Speaker 2: when you is just saying like, for example, I met

23:03 Speaker 2: with doctor Paul and a couple of times. So that's

23:06 Speaker 2: how I got a contact. And what are you If

23:09 Speaker 2: I didn't use that contact, I wouldn't have got his

23:12 Speaker 2: forward from my book in your purpose, right, So you

23:16 Speaker 2: have the contact that or when you encounter God and

23:19 Speaker 2: he comes and tell you, tells you do this or

23:22 Speaker 2: do that, But if you're not taking a step based

23:24 Speaker 2: on it, it's gonna be of no use. So guys,

23:29 Speaker 2: that's why I always challenge you now, like, no matter what,

23:33 Speaker 2: never neglect your time with the Lord. Like one of

23:35 Speaker 2: the things I always tell people is I deal with

23:38 Speaker 2: a lot of young people. I teach their kids in church,

23:41 Speaker 2: and all of them, I say, you know, even if

23:43 Speaker 2: you can't read the typical King King James version of

23:46 Speaker 2: obviously that's like and things like that which you won't understand,

23:50 Speaker 2: or even if you don't understand an Ivy version, there's

23:54 Speaker 2: versions in the Bible that you know are so apt

23:58 Speaker 2: for today's generation. I don't know if you've heard of

23:59 Speaker 2: some thing called the gen Z version of the Bible.

24:02 Speaker 2: I do that because it just uses like God's loves

24:06 Speaker 2: on another level. Do it, and you know, God's lead

24:09 Speaker 2: it or something like that. So there's something called the

24:11 Speaker 2: gen Z Bible. There's something else called manga Bible, where

24:15 Speaker 2: you have the whole Bible in the form of a comic.

24:18 Speaker 2: There's something called audio Bible, video Bible. So I tell people,

24:21 Speaker 2: you know, if you you know, like in a typical

24:23 Speaker 2: case and know, if you ask people you have to

24:26 Speaker 2: read the Bible, read the Bible. That's traditional approach, right,

24:28 Speaker 2: But I tell people that most of the people don't

24:31 Speaker 2: like reading, you know, like they don't have time for reading,

24:34 Speaker 2: they don't like reading.

24:35 Speaker 5: You know, Then how do you expect them to read

24:37 Speaker 5: the Bible.

24:38 Speaker 2: So I tell people, if you can't typically read the Bible,

24:42 Speaker 2: then read it or feed on it in the format.

24:45 Speaker 5: That works for you. That's true, you know what I mean.

24:48 Speaker 2: This is a thing that I always tell you people,

24:51 Speaker 2: right like, in some form or the other. If you

24:54 Speaker 2: don't like an ivy version, go for a gen Z version,

24:57 Speaker 2: or go for the manga version, or if you don't

24:59 Speaker 2: like at all, go for audio bibles. If you're watching

25:02 Speaker 2: this podcast that means you love watching something, then go

25:05 Speaker 2: for video bibles. So some format that works for you.

25:10 Speaker 2: As long as the word is getting on the inside

25:12 Speaker 2: of you, I think that's what will actually sustain you.

25:15 Speaker 2: I remember this scripture says that the Word of God

25:19 Speaker 2: sustained It says in the Book of Jeremiah. So in

25:23 Speaker 2: the sense like how you know you know, I'm a

25:25 Speaker 2: crazy Scooby Doo fan. I'm a record holder for Scooby Doo.

25:29 Speaker 2: So yes, Scooby Doo. Now there's how when Scooby is

25:32 Speaker 2: scared or Scooby faces anything, the first thing is like, Scooby,

25:36 Speaker 2: did you do it for a Scooby snacks? So Scooby

25:39 Speaker 2: Snacks changes Scooby from this scady cat to this brave

25:42 Speaker 2: guy who catches the ghost so same way ask Scooby

25:45 Speaker 2: Snacks is the Word of God. So the more we

25:48 Speaker 2: encounter him and keep feeding on him, that's how we'll

25:52 Speaker 2: actually see the difference in and through our lives.

25:55 Speaker 1: You've been listening to Fuel for the Soul with John Gifta,

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26:51 Speaker 1: Soul with John GIFTA God bless you